Rick Wilson On Trump Being MAGA's False God
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Fast Politics w/ Molly Jong-Fast on YouTube
Fast Politics w/ Molly Jong-Fast
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Speaker
1: Welcome, welcome, Rick Wilson. Speaker 2: Hey, Molly, how are you?
Speaker 1: You know, I do not have a gold statue of me.
10 seconds
Speaker
2: Not yet. Speaker 1: Explain this gold statue story. Speaker 1: Is
there a reason why you don't have a gold statue yet? Speaker 1: Because
people don't love me the way they should.17 seconds
Speaker 1: Can you explain the gold statue story?20 seconds
Speaker
2: Down at Doral, there has now been created a, it is a 22 foot tall,
Speaker 2: Which, if you're using biblical terms, that's 14.47 cubits.33 seconds
Speaker 2: I had to. Speaker 2: Golden statue of Donald Trump. Speaker 2: Why?38 seconds
Speaker 2: It was inaugurated by having a group of MAGA religious figures come and praise and bless it.47 seconds
Speaker
2: Now, it has been a long time since divinity class. Speaker 2: But I
do recall thou shalt have no other God but me was very early.58 seconds
Speaker
2: One of those prohibitions that the Lord in Exodus laid out pretty
clearly. Speaker 2: But this is a example of outright idolatry.1 minute, 7 seconds
Speaker
2: This is an example of how MAGA has become a religion. Speaker 2: And
you know that it hit home because immediately after it, a lot of the
MAGA pastors were suddenly racing to the internet writing 5,000 word
screeds.1 minute, 20 seconds
Speaker 2: It's like, oh, no, no, no, no.1 minute, 22 seconds
Speaker
2: Even though we're all talking about how Trump is better at the Bible
than the Pope and understands everything better than everyone else and
has magical powers, we're not really worshiping him like a god except
that we built a golden statue to him.1 minute, 36 seconds
Speaker 2: The minute someone says, I'm not engaged in idolatry and idol worship, they are engaged in idol worship.1 minute, 42 seconds
Speaker 1: It is also like, you know, Trump, this week we had Marco go over and try to smooth things out with the Pope.1 minute, 50 seconds
Speaker 1: And it is like Trump constantly runs afoul with the pope, which shouldn't be something that a president does.1 minute, 59 seconds
Speaker 2: One should not attempt to run afoul of the pope on a deliberate way.2 minutes, 2 seconds
Speaker
1: What I think is interesting, though, about Trump running afoul with
the pope is that the polling on Trump putting himself in an outfit to
look like Jesus is as like the MAGA no like.2 minutes, 17 seconds
Speaker
2: MAGA no likey. Speaker 2: Yeah. Speaker 2: Look, that has caused
another, one of these other, and look, I keep telling people, like,
never expect a single day where 50% of MAGA goes, I'm done.2 minutes, 30 seconds
Speaker 2: But it's half a percent here, a percent there, 2% here, 2% there.2 minutes, 34 seconds
Speaker
2: And the religious stuff with Catholics fighting with the Holy
Father, going up against the Vicar of Rome is historically a bad bet
politically.2 minutes, 43 seconds
Speaker
2: Yeah. Speaker 2: And Trump keeps doing it. Speaker 2: Yeah. Speaker
2: Marco going over there and giving the Pope a tiny crystal football.2 minutes, 51 seconds
Speaker 1: And didn't he say, didn't he say, oh, wow. Speaker 2: Yeah, the Pope was like, oh, wow.2 minutes, 59 seconds
Speaker
1: The interesting thing about the Pope is, so this is young American
Pope who speaks English Speaker 1: and who became Pope because of his
work in South America.3 minutes, 13 seconds
Speaker 1: his ministering to the poor. And he was not, you know, a celebrity minister. He was a, you know,3 minutes, 20 seconds
Speaker 1: he had a small parish that was really, you know, involved in, in sort of fighting poverty. Right.3 minutes, 28 seconds
Speaker
2: I think it's relevant. You mean, you mean good works amongst the
poor and deserving? Speaker 2: Well, and it's. No private, you didn't
get a private jet out of it, you mean?3 minutes, 36 seconds
Speaker
1: Right. It's relevant when you're the administration that is filled
with kleptocrats and billionaires Speaker 1: to have run afoul with the
Pope who is known for quiet service to the poor?3 minutes, 52 seconds
Speaker 2: There is a broad area of Catholicism that is about those good works amongst the poor.4 minutes, 2 seconds
Speaker
2: There is a very different aspect of American evangelical
Christianity Speaker 2: that is about prosperity gospel and who gets the
biggest jet Speaker 2: And God wants you to be rich if you'll donate to
my church and all that stuff.4 minutes, 17 seconds
Speaker
2: I think that culture clash in some ways really represents a, it sort
of exemplifies what's Speaker 2: going on in America right now, Molly.4 minutes, 26 seconds
Speaker 2: This country has a choice to make, broadly speaking.4 minutes, 30 seconds
Speaker 2: Are we going to do like that hard work of democracy stuff, which is more akin to what4 minutes, 36 seconds
Speaker 2: the Pope does, or are we going to do the cheap sugar rush of, you know, a church that has4 minutes, 42 seconds
Speaker 2: fireworks in it on Sundays and smoke machines and trapeze guys? None of that to me is clearer than4 minutes, 49 seconds
Speaker 2: when you see, you know, this Pope who came out of a very strong tradition of faith and works versus4 minutes, 59 seconds
Speaker
2: the American evangelical movement, which got what they wanted in
Trump, which was a new kind of God. Speaker 1: Right. Prosperity, Bob.5 minutes, 6 seconds
Speaker
2: And that statue going up there, you know, it is – people are making
the North Korea analogy. Speaker 2: That just doesn't get there.5 minutes, 15 seconds
Speaker 2: MAGA feels about Trump with a sense of – he has supplanted God in their faith structure.5 minutes, 22 seconds
Speaker 1: So I want to go from there to here because I both agree with you and also want to add,5 minutes, 32 seconds
Speaker 1: which is I think that when these people go to the gas pump, they are starting.5 minutes, 38 seconds
Speaker 1: So again, to this idea, it's not going to be one day that they all turn.5 minutes, 44 seconds
Speaker
1: But if you think about a huge number of truckers, 60-plus percentage
of truckers voted for Trump, Speaker 1: diesel is as expensive as it
has ever been.5 minutes, 56 seconds
Speaker
1: Diesel is breaking records. Speaker 1: And there are a number of
reasons for that. Speaker 1: But the biggest is because Donald Trump
decided to go into Iran.6 minutes, 6 seconds
Speaker 1: So to to bomb the Iranians. Speaker 1: So I. Speaker 1: Yeah. Speaker 1: And close the straits and diesel.6 minutes, 12 seconds
Speaker
1: So I do think that, like, if you're a trucker who is people are are
smart enough that they understand that four weeks ago or five weeks ago.6 minutes, 22 seconds
Speaker
1: And by the way, Trump today on True Social did this war is not
nearly as long. Speaker 1: You talk about that. Speaker 1: Go. Speaker
2: I knew you would.6 minutes, 30 seconds
Speaker
2: Donald making the analogy and somehow trying to convince people that
either the war is over or that other wars are much longer and why not
give me more time?6 minutes, 42 seconds
Speaker
1: Yeah, he's – Speaker 1: The message disciplinary. Speaker 1: Yeah,
there's a little bit of a cognitive dissonance between those two ideas,
right?6 minutes, 50 seconds
Speaker
2: And as you and I talked about before, there are things in the world
that you just can't spin even if you're the biggest Trump fan in the
universe.6 minutes, 57 seconds
Speaker
2: You sit there at that gas pump and there's no way the gas that is
six bucks that you can say to yourself, I just paid two bucks for gas.
Speaker 2: You can't say that.7 minutes, 5 seconds
Speaker 2: It's not real.7 minutes, 6 seconds
Speaker
2: And the pain of the economic stuff with global oil supplies now
reaching a record low, we've only got about three weeks or so before we
start having big energy shortages around the world because of all this.7 minutes, 21 seconds
Speaker 2: And here in America as well.7 minutes, 23 seconds
Speaker
1: And what I think is pretty interesting is that you can tell that
Trump gets that and you can tell that he is like, I want to end the war
now because you're starting to see he's starting to say, well, it's
over.7 minutes, 40 seconds
Speaker
1: We got a one. We got this one page peace agreement. By the way, just
because our leader can't read doesn't mean they can't read.7 minutes, 48 seconds
Speaker 1: Like they could give him five pages. You know, they could give the Iranians five pages.7 minutes, 52 seconds
Speaker
2: Somebody could summarize it for Trump in one page, but most
diplomatic agreements in the world have some complexity and some depth
and some granularity to them. And this idea there's a one-page agreement
for me, once again, that smelled like Trump trying to pump the stock
market rather than sealing a real deal that memorializes America's
defeat against Iran.8 minutes, 14 seconds
Speaker
1: But when we were talking before, I was thinking so much about like
how we've had these moments in American democracy where you and I and
people on television, all of us have said, you know, this is about
American democracy.8 minutes, 27 seconds
Speaker
1: American democracy is important because of that. Speaker 1: And
people will be like, yeah, I guess. Speaker 1: But we didn't like the
woman candidate or I guess. Speaker 1: Right.8 minutes, 35 seconds
Speaker 1: But like people don't actually vote on democracy or at least they don't in the way and they don't vote enough.8 minutes, 42 seconds
Speaker
1: Like they might vote in the midterms on it, but they're not going to
defeat Trump on it now. Speaker 2: Especially now with the economic
economic pressure being so high on everybody.8 minutes, 50 seconds
Speaker
1: But now that Donald Trump has just completely failed to deliver, he
basically has done the opposite of everything he ran. Speaker 1: Yes.8 minutes, 59 seconds
Speaker 1: I do think people are I mean, like the polling is is gonzo.9 minutes, 5 seconds
Speaker
1: Like it is literally like the strongly talk us through the polling
because you are. Speaker 2: And look, I want to say something to
Democrats really quickly.9 minutes, 12 seconds
Speaker
2: I know everybody's kind of depressed about the redistricting stuff.
Speaker 2: Nothing has changed about the polling environment in the
country. Speaker 1: Right.9 minutes, 19 seconds
Speaker
2: A lot of these things that they've done are going to help them a
little, but they have Speaker 2: a problem that is so much bigger that
you can't redistrict your way out of.9 minutes, 27 seconds
Speaker 1: And it could hurt them, right? Speaker 1: Because if you're an R plus four, it's an R plus 10. Speaker 2: Yeah.9 minutes, 34 seconds
Speaker 2: So I think one of the biggest things to consider right now is his numbers on economic performance are at record lows.9 minutes, 43 seconds
Speaker
2: They are where Biden's numbers were in the worst when we had 10
percent inflation. Speaker 2: They are really, really, really
catastrophic.9 minutes, 51 seconds
Speaker
2: But one thing we're watching that's emerging and more and more
polling when you're asking people, is your vote in favor of the
Republicans, in favor of the Democrats, or to put a check on Trump in
Washington?10 minutes, 3 seconds
Speaker 2: That number of people checking Trump's behavior, they want someone to slam on the brakes on Trump.10 minutes, 10 seconds
Speaker
2: I think that should, for Republicans, be the most concerning number
because none of them have done the smart thing and gotten away from
Trump.10 minutes, 20 seconds
Speaker
2: Mike Lawler, who is one of the most endangered Republicans in the
country, 10 days ago was like, oh, we need the ballroom.10 minutes, 27 seconds
Speaker 2: That message is not working for the average American who's paying five bucks plus for gas.10 minutes, 32 seconds
Speaker
1: And I think this is a real problem for Republicans, which is so what
happened last week, Donald Trump ran in Illinois in Indiana against
all.10 minutes, 42 seconds
Speaker
1: So there were people who refused to redistrict and Donald Trump
basically ran. Speaker 1: He primered all of them and many of them lost.10 minutes, 51 seconds
Speaker
1: So the idea here now is that Donald Trump has the party in
Lockstead. Speaker 1: But here is the problem. Speaker 1: Donald Trump
has control over the primary base.11 minutes, 1 second
Speaker 1: Right. Speaker 1: the Republican base, but he doesn't have he can't grow the party enough.11 minutes, 6 seconds
Speaker
1: So if you are running for if you're Mike Lawler and you're running
for reelection, you have Speaker 1: to hit yourself to Trump.11 minutes, 13 seconds
Speaker 1: You have to ballroom with Trump while still trying to win in a purple district. Speaker 2: Right.11 minutes, 20 seconds
Speaker
2: And I think the problem right now for most Republicans, most
Republicans are so tightly Speaker 2: bound up to Donald Trump. Speaker
2: They've epoxied themselves to Donald Trump.11 minutes, 29 seconds
Speaker
2: They're glued to him. Speaker 2: And that stuff doesn't go away in
the age of the internet. Speaker 1: Right. Speaker 2: It's always going
to be there. Speaker 2: Mike Lawler could tomorrow go out and say, I
think we should impeach Donald Trump.11 minutes, 38 seconds
Speaker
2: And I'll still have a clip of him saying we've got to build a
ballroom for Donald Trump. Speaker 1: Right. Speaker 2: They're afraid.
Speaker 2: As you pointed out, in Indiana, you saw Trump's ability in a
Republican primary to blow people out.11 minutes, 50 seconds
Speaker
1: Right. Speaker 2: To go in there and blow people up and get rid of
people he doesn't want. Speaker 2: Right. Speaker 2: Well, these guys
all live in that sense of constant fear of Trump and of his base.12 minutes
Speaker
2: Right. Speaker 2: And I think as primary season ends, you might see a
few of them running for daylight. Speaker 2: It's been so long of them
doing this, I don't know how they get away.12 minutes, 9 seconds
Speaker
1: But if you are running for daylight, say you're making the calculus
that you are Michael Lawler, because he's a good example, because he's
in a D district.12 minutes, 17 seconds
Speaker
1: Right. Speaker 1: And which is only going to get more, is only more
Democratic now. Speaker 1: Correct. Speaker 1: So he's in a district
that Harris won.12 minutes, 24 seconds
Speaker
1: If you're Mike Lawler, you're thinking, well, this president has
this president has terrible numbers, so I have to run against him.12 minutes, 33 seconds
Speaker
1: But if I run against him at all, MAGA won't come out for me. Speaker
2: It's a terrible conundrum, and I really feel for them right now.
Speaker 1: Yeah.12 minutes, 41 seconds
Speaker 2: My heart breaks for them right now. Speaker 1: But and I mean, you must see that everywhere.12 minutes, 47 seconds
Speaker 1: Right. You must see Republicans trying to because if you Trump is not a candidate where like with Biden,12 minutes, 53 seconds
Speaker 1: Biden would say, you know, if you have to run against me, it's OK. Right. Or remember Nancy12 minutes, 59 seconds
Speaker 1: Pelosi, if you need to break with me to keep the seat, it's OK. In 2018, Nancy Pelosi went out and13 minutes, 6 seconds
Speaker
2: explicitly said to Democratic congressional candidates, hey, if
you're not if you're not Speaker 2: if they're hanging too much stuff
from D.C. on you, you can say, hey, I'm not going to be like13 minutes, 16 seconds
Speaker
2: one of those Democrats. I'm an independent Democrat from this
district. And no one. No. Speaker 2: Well, I won't say no one, but
people were in on the trick.13 minutes, 27 seconds
Speaker 1: People were in on the strategy. Speaker 2: They were like, OK.13 minutes, 30 seconds
Speaker
2: You know, even more progressive groups were like, OK, we got to get
this person over the Speaker 2: line so we can get a majority.13 minutes, 36 seconds
Speaker
2: And so we're not going to go out and nuke them if they don't say
exactly the right thing Speaker 2: on, you know, every single issue.
Speaker 2: And they're running in Missouri or Kentucky or whatever.13 minutes, 46 seconds
Speaker 1: And in 2018, Democrats flipped three congressional seats in the state of Iowa.13 minutes, 55 seconds
Speaker 1: Yep. Speaker 1: And Iowa this year, we had this guy on, by the way, Rob Sand.14 minutes, 5 seconds
Speaker 1: He's going to be president. Speaker 2: He's got the gift, Molly. Speaker 2: He's got the gift.14 minutes, 10 seconds
Speaker
2: My colleague Joe Trippi called me about a month ago when he was out
there and he said, Speaker 2: are you paying attention to this guy yet?
Speaker 2: I'm like, I've heard the name.14 minutes, 17 seconds
Speaker
2: I don't, and so I watch some clips, Speaker 2: and he gets better
every interview. Speaker 2: He's frighteningly good, and you know what?14 minutes, 27 seconds
Speaker
2: I also think, and I'm not one of those dreamy-eyed people Speaker 2:
who gets swept up in the talent. Speaker 1: You really aren't.14 minutes, 35 seconds
Speaker 2: I'm really not. Speaker 2: Yeah. Speaker 2: But he has the talent.14 minutes, 39 seconds
Speaker 2: And there's a thing in politics that if you've got the gift, Speaker 1: Yeah.14 minutes, 44 seconds
Speaker
2: It transcends party stuff because you walked into a sat in the room
with Barack Obama and you came away and you felt inspired. Speaker 2:
You sat in a room with George Bush.14 minutes, 53 seconds
Speaker
2: You felt like he was your best friend. Speaker 1: You sat in a room
with Bill Clinton. Speaker 2: You felt like he understood your heart.
Speaker 2: You sat in a room with Ronald Reagan and you felt like you
could do anything when you walked out that door.15 minutes, 4 seconds
Speaker
2: And this guy has that gift. Speaker 1: After the interview, I said,
Jesse, this guy's going to be president. Speaker 2: Molly's like, I'm
moving to Iowa.15 minutes, 13 seconds
Speaker 1: I mean, the guy is so good. Speaker 1: But he also, more importantly than that, he's 6'3".15 minutes, 21 seconds
Speaker
2: Wilson, it matters. Speaker 2: It matters. Speaker 1: After we
interviewed him, I said, so are you going to run for president next?15 minutes, 27 seconds
Speaker
1: And he said, I am just running for governor of Iowa, which is the
only okay answer. Speaker 2: It's a perfectly good answer. Speaker 1:
Right.15 minutes, 36 seconds
Speaker
1: And then I said, how tall are you? Speaker 1: And I said, because he
also looks very young. Speaker 1: Yeah, he does look young.15 minutes, 44 seconds
Speaker 1: And he's 43. Speaker 2: We are reaching a point right now where young Democratic leaders are coming up.15 minutes, 53 seconds
Speaker
2: They're going to replace the septuagenarian class who have in many
ways been so traumatized by the Republicans for so long that they don't
fight the right way.16 minutes, 2 seconds
Speaker
2: And they don't speak American, as David Cousin had always said.
Speaker 2: And speaking American is what you see Rob Sand doing.16 minutes, 9 seconds
Speaker
2: And look, I think Iowa, I think there's motion in Nebraska, which
makes me feel like I'm taking crazy pills. Speaker 2: That's Dan
Osborne. Speaker 2: Iowa and Nebraska.16 minutes, 18 seconds
Speaker 2: Yep, that's Dan Osborne. Speaker 2: I think Dan, you know, Ricketts is like a sock puppet Republican.16 minutes, 26 seconds
Speaker
2: Like aside from the checkbook, there's no there there. Speaker 1:
But it is a big checkbook. Speaker 2: It is a big checkbook. Speaker 1:
Vivek is flailing.16 minutes, 33 seconds
Speaker
2: Amy Acton is doing very well in Ohio. Speaker 1: They're moving up.
Speaker 2: Ditchie and David Pepper are moving up fast.16 minutes, 38 seconds
Speaker
2: There is something going on with Democrats who have learned to talk
about the economy again and center the lives of ordinary people,
Republicans and Democrats and nonpartisan voters, on the economic crisis
they all feel and the economic pain they're all terrified of.16 minutes, 56 seconds
Speaker 1: Right. Speaker 2: Well, shit, let's keep doing more of that because it seems to be working.17 minutes
Speaker
1: And one of the things that I saw, so AOC spoke at the Politics
Institute in Chicago, interviewed by not some crazy lefty, right? And he
talked about David. We're talking about David. And by the way, David
also was with the Pope recently. So let's all be some. He's not running
until he is the Pope.17 minutes, 25 seconds
Speaker
1: But he was talking to AOC and AOC did the thing. Speaker 1: I
actually thought this was interesting. Speaker 1: I wondered if she had
stole it from Mondami.17 minutes, 34 seconds
Speaker
1: So Zoran. Speaker 1: So she said he was asking her a question.
Speaker 1: Oh, he was asking her a question about running for president.
Speaker 2: Right. Speaker 2: She said, I want to change the country.17 minutes, 44 seconds
Speaker
1: Yeah. Speaker 1: I want something more than running for president.
Speaker 1: I want to change the country. Speaker 1: And that made me
think, like, because that's the kind of answer we see from Zoran, right?17 minutes, 53 seconds
Speaker
1: Like, what do you think about, you know, I can't think about that
right now because I'm laser focused on affordability. Speaker 1: I'm
thinking about fast free buses. Speaker 2: Right.18 minutes, 1 second
Speaker 1: I wondered about that. Speaker 2: Listen, I am a big believer in being on message. Speaker 1: Yeah.18 minutes, 6 seconds
Speaker
2: And that doing well means you, you know, doing good while you're in
your first job means you can do well in the next one and when you're
running for the next one.18 minutes, 16 seconds
Speaker
2: And so, look, when you see AOC, who's a gifted politician, who's a
gifted speaker, gifted communicator, say that, that's very sweeping, but
it still feels kind of like me, not you.18 minutes, 30 seconds
Speaker 2: Right. Speaker 2: I don't think that's irreparable in any way whatsoever.18 minutes, 34 seconds
Speaker
2: But I think that you've seen a lot of these other candidates in the
last year, Virginia, New Jersey, everywhere else, who are talking about
you, not me.18 minutes, 44 seconds
Speaker 2: I think it's important. Speaker 1: She did.18 minutes, 47 seconds
Speaker
1: I mean, I think the problem for her is the problem for all female
politicians, though, which is she gets her celebrity ends up eclipsing
her in a certain way.18 minutes, 59 seconds
Speaker
1: Though in that answer, she did talk about single payer, that she
said what she her legacy would be single payer, which in a moment when
when millions of people are getting kicked off Obamacare because
Republicans refused to renew the tax credits.19 minutes, 17 seconds
Speaker
2: Obamacare being what I call just the tip socialist health care.
Speaker 2: Right. Speaker 2: It's not exactly like a not exactly like
like a Nordic socialist health care plan.19 minutes, 27 seconds
Speaker 2: Certainly not. Speaker 2: But it fascinates me in some ways that Republicans don't get that.19 minutes, 37 seconds
Speaker
2: Could be a real knife in their own guts because their people rely on
it more at per capita in a lot of these big red states than Democratic
voters do, which is madness when you think about it.19 minutes, 51 seconds
Speaker
2: They are cutting off their nose to spite their own face, and it's
not covered, even with a copay. Speaker 1: Rick Wilson, even with the
co-pay.20 minutes, 2 seconds
Speaker 1: I'll see you next time. Speaker 2: Absolutely.
Fast Politics w/ Molly Jong-Fast
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